Football's Darkest Secret

[Pompey Penguin]

I have just caught up with this doccy, which was on three nights earlier this week.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episodes/ ... est-secret

A tough watch at times (tears were shed by the interviewees, me and the people I watched with), even though I thought I knew the story. The BBC intro stated the standard " some viewers might find some scences upsetting", but to be honest everyone should find parts of it upsetting. Really brave people willing to appear on the programme.

At the end, a caption stated that over 300 abusers have been reported from 300 clubs, so not just the high profile cases covered in depth. Also, from recent gymnastic revelations, such abuse is likely to have happened in other sports, dance schools, stage schools, music schools, etc. No-one should be resting on tehir laurels and claiming it doesn't happen in their activity.

You might not enjoy it, but it should be required watching for anyone involved or interested in football.

[pompeygunner]

Its very upsetting/sad that so many young lives were ruined. What I cant fathom is the one @ SFC was conducting "naked soapy massages" of the young lads. Surely they were telling their parents. Then you have people who knew & told Ted Bates but he covered it up for want of better words. I'm not singling them out just using it as is of interest to us in the region. Then you have Crewe, Dario Gradi-so highly though of because of the youth setup there knew about it but covered it up.
But football apart this is going on in most industries I'd imagine. Peados are extremely conniving & will position themselves in areas that will give them maximum opportunity. Its too horrible to contemplate.

[Keeprblue]

It was said that Alan shearer and Micky Channon was found by this scumbag Bob Higgins in Southampton, who I'd never heard of until this sad emotional program.
How many other youngsters in sport (athletics, Gymnastics et al) have been abused by these vile paedophiles?

[Jack_Tinn]

disturbing, distressing, emotional, sobering, thought provoking and brilliant.

Those men are victims but also brave, honest, determined heroes.

The very end of the third episode (with the statistics about the number of complaints and clubs involved) is still difficult to take in

[GreenBlue]

Its very upsetting/sad that so many young lives were ruined.

Unfortunately it was not only their young lives that were ruined. Victims will feel those disgusting attacks for the rest of their lives.

It is hard to fathom how they got away with such vile crimes but total respect to those brave enough to speak out to hopefully prevent such widespread abuse happening again.

[Blue Walter]

I think I am going to get a bit of flak here. I feel very sorry for those players who's lives were altered for the worse by these people and I agree it was brave of them to tell of their accounts of what happened to them. Keeping all that bottled up when they moved into the professional game must have been hard for them and the untold vanquish it must have caused them. However, what would have been really brave and of great service to the youngsters that followed them into the youth teams that these players had moved on from was to have spoken up once they were away from the clutches of the perpetrators. Once they had made the grade into the first team squad they should have blown the whistle so as to stop the young boys following them going through the same trauma as they did. I know people will say it is easier to say that than actually doing it, and I agree with that, but if some of those players had spoken up in the early days many boys would not have suffered the same fate as them. That would have taken true courage but it would have saved so many boys lives being ruined.

[PakefieldBlue]

I think I am going to get a bit of flak here. I feel very sorry for those players who's lives were altered for the worse by these people and I agree it was brave of them to tell of their accounts of what happened to them. Keeping all that bottled up when they moved into the professional game must have been hard for them and the untold vanquish it must have caused them. However, what would have been really brave and of great service to the youngsters that followed them into the youth teams that these players had moved on from was to have spoken up once they were away from the clutches of the perpetrators. Once they had made the grade into the first team squad they should have blown the whistle so as to stop the young boys following them going through the same trauma as they did. I know people will say it is easier to say that than actually doing it, and I agree with that, but if some of those players had spoken up in the early days many boys would not have suffered the same fate as them. That would have taken true courage but it would have saved so many boys lives being ruined.

I guess that unless we were in their position we have no idea what it was like and how difficult it would have been to speak out. The victims aren't responsible for what happened to the other victims, the perpetrators are and those in authority who knew about it and turned a blind eye.

[Pompey Penguin]

I think I am going to get a bit of flak here. I feel very sorry for those players who's lives were altered for the worse by these people and I agree it was brave of them to tell of their accounts of what happened to them. Keeping all that bottled up when they moved into the professional game must have been hard for them and the untold vanquish it must have caused them. However, what would have been really brave and of great service to the youngsters that followed them into the youth teams that these players had moved on from was to have spoken up once they were away from the clutches of the perpetrators. Once they had made the grade into the first team squad they should have blown the whistle so as to stop the young boys following them going through the same trauma as they did. I know people will say it is easier to say that than actually doing it, and I agree with that, but if some of those players had spoken up in the early days many boys would not have suffered the same fate as them. That would have taken true courage but it would have saved so many boys lives being ruined.

This was touched on in the programme, and is typical of abuse survivors' reactions. They felt guilt, shame and thought that somehow it was all their fault. There was also the worry that it made them gay whilst being in a seriously homophobic environment, which football still remains. One interviewee described how as one boy got "too old" they helped (in some small way) to groom the next in line; so the guilt there must have been enormous. It is clear from the programme that even as middle-aged adults, the victims have awful problems and challenges in describing what happened to them; I am not sure that this would have been possible in their late-teens/early twenties.

Often no-one listened to the victims or believed they were telling the truth, even years later. In a 1990s court case, six victims were willing to stand up and speak, but the judge fitted up the case by splitting it into six individual trials, so that each one with a separate jury was one person's word against another; after the first one failed, the prosecution gave up on the other five. In the first Higgins trial, with many accusers, the jury still couldn't agree on a verdict; at least three jurors wouldn't believe the men. The obstacles were immense.

David White tells how he wanted to speak to his parents, but knew that his father would (literally) have killed Bennell, and didn't want to lay that burden on his father. I was very moved by the mothers who spoke out about their own feelings that they should have known what was going on, and that their"failure" somehow made them bad parents.

One last point. There were a few shots of NSPCC hotline workers (volunteers?) taking calls from those reporting abuse. How they do that job day after day, listening to those stories repeated again and again is beyond me.

[Sam_Brown]

I think I am going to get a bit of flak here. I feel very sorry for those players who's lives were altered for the worse by these people and I agree it was brave of them to tell of their accounts of what happened to them. Keeping all that bottled up when they moved into the professional game must have been hard for them and the untold vanquish it must have caused them. However, what would have been really brave and of great service to the youngsters that followed them into the youth teams that these players had moved on from was to have spoken up once they were away from the clutches of the perpetrators. Once they had made the grade into the first team squad they should have blown the whistle so as to stop the young boys following them going through the same trauma as they did. I know people will say it is easier to say that than actually doing it, and I agree with that, but if some of those players had spoken up in the early days many boys would not have suffered the same fate as them. That would have taken true courage but it would have saved so many boys lives being ruined.

This was touched on in the programme, and is typical of abuse survivors' reactions. They felt guilt, shame and thought that somehow it was all their fault. There was also the worry that it made them gay whilst being in a seriously homophobic environment, which football still remains. One interviewee described how as one boy got "too old" they helped (in some small way) to groom the next in line; so the guilt there must have been enormous. It is clear from the programme that even as middle-aged adults, the victims have awful problems and challenges in describing what happened to them; I am not sure that this would have been possible in their late-teens/early twenties.

Often no-one listened to the victims or believed they were telling the truth, even years later. In a 1990s court case, six victims were willing to stand up and speak, but the judge fitted up the case by splitting it into six individual trials, so that each one with a separate jury was one person's word against another; after the first one failed, the prosecution gave up on the other five. In the first Higgins trial, with many accusers, the jury still couldn't agree on a verdict; at least three jurors wouldn't believe the men. The obstacles were immense.

David White tells how he wanted to speak to his parents, but knew that his father would (literally) have killed Bennell, and didn't want to lay that burden on his father. I was very moved by the mothers who spoke out about their own feelings that they should have known what was going on, and that their"failure" somehow made them bad parents.

One last point. There were a few shots of NSPCC hotline workers (volunteers?) taking calls from those reporting abuse. How they do that job day after day, listening to those stories repeated again and again is beyond me.

Well thought out post PP. The volunteers who work on the phones for places like NSPCC or the Samaritans or one of the other amazing companies out there trying to offer help really do amaze me. A good reminder that while there are a lot of evil pricks out there there are some good ones as well.

[Mr Dee]

This is a good documentary https://www.netflix.com/title/81034185? ... 47225&t=cp

[Mickemo]

Some good discussion here

Like many of us on this forum i suspect, as a young lad I desperately wanted to be a pro footballer...prob just as well my Dad hated football and held me back based upon the evidence of these programmes.

Utterly shocking what these (excuse for) people in positions of trust did to their victims - I cant imagine how those poor young lads felt at the time, so keen to make it in the pro game they endured hell to get a shot at their dream.

100% agree with the point about Samaritans/NSPCC doing amazing work.

[uspompeyfan]

This board has had its good and bad threads....this is one of the very best to be honest.

I was involved with Terry Gibson at Bristol Rovers as the 70s turned into the 80s. Paul Rideout and Phil Kite were two of the players I played alongside in the youth/ Reserves. I wasn't ever good enough to turn pro.

I never saw any of this going on during that time, but recall the desperate need to get into the top tier. I wasn't close, but at that age, we weren't prepared for the media (different world and nowhere near what it is today, back then) and there was a distinct us against them when it came to the stars. Could their pride get them to turn in their mentors once they got famous? Possibly not, and I thank God I was never in that position.

I believe it happens in all 'artistic' professions. You just have to look at Harvey Weinstein and many others in Hollywood along with the 'casting couch' stories over the past 30 plus years that no one seemed to take seriously in that industry. Perhaps in some way, we are all guilty of turning our backs to the possibilities of this behavior ever occurring.

I was ripped to shreds for bringing up incidents at my Catholic church when I was a boarder in Prep school (I was a choir boy in Bath, and witnessed stuff that happened to my friends). I was blamed as a trouble maker by those close to me, and as a kid, I then kept quiet for fear of rejection. Imagine if the same treatment was going to come for the victims, I can imagine they would never open their mouths.... adding in the homophobia that was prevelent at the time, the guilty monsters could, sadly, easily hide in the shadows.