Is this the best we can do??

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Blue Walter
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Blue Walter »

Has anyone considered that there could be a possible explanation why we are unable to compete with the Ipswich's of this league at this juncture? It could be that funds have been set aside for deals that are already set up. I would think funds would have to be set aside should there be a chance we could bring Hirst back and the possibility of the Spurs player, or any other players supposedly on Cowley's radar. This could be a reason that it seems to be so quiet regarding our club and the apparent lack of transfer funds. I don't know, of course, and I am not convinced that the club is really looking at a genuine promotion attempt this coming season but the type of business being done, or perceived business, will go a long way to demonstrate how serious they are. On the other hand they might be saving their cash for later to spend on 'assets' to sell later for a profit when the become available. Who knows?
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Portchesterblue2 »

Pompey55 wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 6:19 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club
Surely waiting until the window shuts on 1 September is leaving it a bit late to see some reasonable recruitment I would have thought we need most of the new squad in situ by the home friendly on 23 July as otherwise we would be half a dozen or so matches into the season
[/quote]

I wasnt suggesting that we should leave it till the window shuts to do all the business, I was merely pointing out that until we cant do any more business I will trust that they are in the process of recruiting
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Portchesterblue2 »

jam tomorrow wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 7:22 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club

In the meantime we are at a disadvantage by not having any new players training with the team the later we leave it the harder it will be to start the season well.
thats right a huge disadvantage over the other teams who have all bought all their players already :thumb
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Milton End »

Portchesterblue2 wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:07 am
jam tomorrow wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 7:22 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club

In the meantime we are at a disadvantage by not having any new players training with the team the later we leave it the harder it will be to start the season well.
thats right a huge disadvantage over the other teams who have all bought all their players already :thumb
And this late recruitment situation has been the same for the last few years. Hopefully, the Cowleys know what they're doing......
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Pompey55 »

Hopefully, the Cowleys know what they're doing......
[/quote]

Well that’s something I had never actually considered :D
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Blue Walter »

Personally I don't trust the club anymore than most businesses that rely on the public for income. In fact I would think the only people you can really trust is your nearest and dearest. That is not as negative as it may well appear because we live in a very different world now where PR and media rule. I think we have good owners who are as honest as they can be and they have so far stuck to their word. They never promised they would chuck loads of money at the team and they said that wanted to build up the club so it would be a sustainable and self standing business. They said it would take time and there would be no immediate success, brick by brick is their mantra. I have a suspicion that they don't really want promotion just yet but are ambitious enough to want it but only when the club are ready. I believe any profit they make which is generated by the club will go back into the club.

So where does trust and honesty come into this? To publicly say that we are not really that keen on going up just yet would hit ticket sales. Talk of promotion keeps the natives interested but talk of slow pragmatic building is not so exciting, especially in the shot term. If we were to get promotion they would take of course but I think the real aim could be competing at the top end of the table. That's until the time is right.
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Claygate »

Portchesterblue2 wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:07 am
jam tomorrow wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 7:22 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club

In the meantime we are at a disadvantage by not having any new players training with the team the later we leave it the harder it will be to start the season well.
thats right a huge disadvantage over the other teams who have all bought all their players already :thumb
Pompey are one of 5 League One teams that have not made a single signing.

Our competitors on the other hand who share similar aspirations for promotion have made signings thus far. Ipswich 3; MK Dons 3; Peterborough 3; Bolton 3; Sheffield Wednesday 3; Barnsley 2; Charlton 2. Wycombe 1 and Plymouth 1.

A lot of these signings are freebies and loans. So I would say Pompey have made a slow start with regards to transfers. If we are not careful, we could end up losing out on our no. 1 targets. Scott Twine and Jayden Stockley being prime examples from seasons gone by.

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/foot ... es-3740336
Last edited by Claygate on Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:11 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Pompey55 »

I blame the RMT no one can get here to sign
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Sam_Brown »

Claygate wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:08 pm
Portchesterblue2 wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:07 am
jam tomorrow wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 7:22 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club

In the meantime we are at a disadvantage by not having any new players training with the team the later we leave it the harder it will be to start the season well.
thats right a huge disadvantage over the other teams who have all bought all their players already :thumb
Pompey are one of 5 League One teams that have not made a single signing.

Our competitors on the other hand who share similar aspirations for promotion have made signings thus far. Ipswich 3; MK Dons 3; Peterborough 3; Bolton 3; Sheffield Wednesday 3; Barnsley 2; Charlton 2. Wycombe 1 and Plymouth 1.

A lot of these signings are freebies and loans. So I would say Pompey have made a slow start with regards to transfers. If we are not careful, we could end up losing out on our no. 1 targets. Scott Twine and Jayden Stockley being prime examples from seasons gone by.

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/foot ... es-3740336
That’s fine. I’m reliably informed that loans and frees do t count anyway.
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Portchesterblue2 »

Claygate wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 7:08 pm
Portchesterblue2 wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 8:07 am
jam tomorrow wrote: Mon Jun 20, 2022 7:22 pm Until the window shuts and no players have been signed I will trust the club

In the meantime we are at a disadvantage by not having any new players training with the team the later we leave it the harder it will be to start the season well.
thats right a huge disadvantage over the other teams who have all bought all their players already :thumb
Pompey are one of 5 League One teams that have not made a single signing.

Our competitors on the other hand who share similar aspirations for promotion have made signings thus far. Ipswich 3; MK Dons 3; Peterborough 3; Bolton 3; Sheffield Wednesday 3; Barnsley 2; Charlton 2. Wycombe 1 and Plymouth 1.

A lot of these signings are freebies and loans. So I would say Pompey have made a slow start with regards to transfers. If we are not careful, we could end up losing out on our no. 1 targets. Scott Twine and Jayden Stockley being prime examples from seasons gone by.

https://www.portsmouth.co.uk/sport/foot ... es-3740336
good examples used there
Scott Twine who IIRC we never actually made any sort of offer for
Jayden Stockley who if we had tried to buy on day 1 or last day was going to go to Charlton whatever
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Locky_McLockface
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Locky_McLockface »

Blue Walter wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:03 am Personally I don't trust the club anymore than most businesses that rely on the public for income. In fact I would think the only people you can really trust is your nearest and dearest. That is not as negative as it may well appear because we live in a very different world now where PR and media rule. I think we have good owners who are as honest as they can be and they have so far stuck to their word. They never promised they would chuck loads of money at the team and they said that wanted to build up the club so it would be a sustainable and self standing business. They said it would take time and there would be no immediate success, brick by brick is their mantra. I have a suspicion that they don't really want promotion just yet but are ambitious enough to want it but only when the club are ready. I believe any profit they make which is generated by the club will go back into the club.

So where does trust and honesty come into this? To publicly say that we are not really that keen on going up just yet would hit ticket sales. Talk of promotion keeps the natives interested but talk of slow pragmatic building is not so exciting, especially in the shot term. If we were to get promotion they would take of course but I think the real aim could be competing at the top end of the table. That's until the time is right.
This makes a lot of sense to me.

Tornante have just invested a new tranche of money into the club. They aren't writing that money off, they want to recoup their investment and make a profit on it.

Here's the thing.

They aren't going to be able to do that in League 1.

That's obvious to anyone and everyone.

They said categorically that success would not come overnight, and they have been true to that. In order to recoup their investment, they need facilities that people will want to use and visit, and not just on a Saturday afternoon.

Covid has put a spanner in those works, and delayed the project by a couple of years. I also suspect that they're being frustrated in their plans somewhat by Network Rail and the link with Fratton Station.

The problem is, in some fans' heads, that they've seen at least two other clubs in a similar position to ours woosh up to the Prem quite quickly after a takeover, and the two I'm thinking of are both very close to us geographically. There's a certain element of jealousy there.

But those fans need to take a step back, and look at what Tornante have to do. Southampton already had excellent facilities at St Mary's before their fall from grace, so funds could be ploughed into the playing squad. We just can't do that.

So, I think Walter is right. I don't think they do want promotion this year, although they'll take it if it happens. I think they want to invest in Fratton Park first, whilst the wage bill is still at L1 levels, and then we'll see investment in the squad.
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Pompey55 »

Hope Cowley isn’t looking at to much other clubs local press Mark Robins has pretty much indicated that unless Walker really impresses in preseason he has no future at Coventry I guess he will be going cheap then!
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Portchesterblue2 »

Locky_McLockface wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:56 am
Blue Walter wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:03 am Personally I don't trust the club anymore than most businesses that rely on the public for income. In fact I would think the only people you can really trust is your nearest and dearest. That is not as negative as it may well appear because we live in a very different world now where PR and media rule. I think we have good owners who are as honest as they can be and they have so far stuck to their word. They never promised they would chuck loads of money at the team and they said that wanted to build up the club so it would be a sustainable and self standing business. They said it would take time and there would be no immediate success, brick by brick is their mantra. I have a suspicion that they don't really want promotion just yet but are ambitious enough to want it but only when the club are ready. I believe any profit they make which is generated by the club will go back into the club.

So where does trust and honesty come into this? To publicly say that we are not really that keen on going up just yet would hit ticket sales. Talk of promotion keeps the natives interested but talk of slow pragmatic building is not so exciting, especially in the shot term. If we were to get promotion they would take of course but I think the real aim could be competing at the top end of the table. That's until the time is right.
This makes a lot of sense to me.

Tornante have just invested a new tranche of money into the club. They aren't writing that money off, they want to recoup their investment and make a profit on it.

you say they arent writing it off, but by putting it into the club as equity and not as a loan they put that investment at risk.
If the money was loaned to club, if they decide to sell that loan would have to be repaid, by putting it as equity, if the club is sold, they only get what the club is worth at the time, so if we dropped leagues they would likely lose out.
so yes they want a return on that investment, but its an investment more to the benefit of the club than them
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Locky_McLockface
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Locky_McLockface »

Portchesterblue2 wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 12:48 pm
Locky_McLockface wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:56 am
Blue Walter wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:03 am Personally I don't trust the club anymore than most businesses that rely on the public for income. In fact I would think the only people you can really trust is your nearest and dearest. That is not as negative as it may well appear because we live in a very different world now where PR and media rule. I think we have good owners who are as honest as they can be and they have so far stuck to their word. They never promised they would chuck loads of money at the team and they said that wanted to build up the club so it would be a sustainable and self standing business. They said it would take time and there would be no immediate success, brick by brick is their mantra. I have a suspicion that they don't really want promotion just yet but are ambitious enough to want it but only when the club are ready. I believe any profit they make which is generated by the club will go back into the club.

So where does trust and honesty come into this? To publicly say that we are not really that keen on going up just yet would hit ticket sales. Talk of promotion keeps the natives interested but talk of slow pragmatic building is not so exciting, especially in the shot term. If we were to get promotion they would take of course but I think the real aim could be competing at the top end of the table. That's until the time is right.
This makes a lot of sense to me.

Tornante have just invested a new tranche of money into the club. They aren't writing that money off, they want to recoup their investment and make a profit on it.
you say they arent writing it off, but by putting it into the club as equity and not as a loan they put that investment at risk.
If the money was loaned to club, if they decide to sell that loan would have to be repaid, by putting it as equity, if the club is sold, they only get what the club is worth at the time, so if we dropped leagues they would likely lose out.
so yes they want a return on that investment, but its an investment more to the benefit of the club than them
In fairness, as we saw with the Gaydamaks, etc., if they input the capital as a loan, and the company were to go into administration or liquidation, that loan is still very much at risk. As you say, if the value of the equity falls, due to relegation, then they would certainly lose out. Which makes it all the more certain that they will make sure we go upwards not downwards.
I before E except when you run a feisty heist on a weird beige foreign neighbour
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Re: Is this the best we can do??

Post by Blue Walter »

Locky_McLockface wrote: Fri Jun 24, 2022 12:39 pm
Portchesterblue2 wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 12:48 pm
Locky_McLockface wrote: Thu Jun 23, 2022 9:56 am
Blue Walter wrote: Tue Jun 21, 2022 10:03 am Personally I don't trust the club anymore than most businesses that rely on the public for income. In fact I would think the only people you can really trust is your nearest and dearest. That is not as negative as it may well appear because we live in a very different world now where PR and media rule. I think we have good owners who are as honest as they can be and they have so far stuck to their word. They never promised they would chuck loads of money at the team and they said that wanted to build up the club so it would be a sustainable and self standing business. They said it would take time and there would be no immediate success, brick by brick is their mantra. I have a suspicion that they don't really want promotion just yet but are ambitious enough to want it but only when the club are ready. I believe any profit they make which is generated by the club will go back into the club.

So where does trust and honesty come into this? To publicly say that we are not really that keen on going up just yet would hit ticket sales. Talk of promotion keeps the natives interested but talk of slow pragmatic building is not so exciting, especially in the shot term. If we were to get promotion they would take of course but I think the real aim could be competing at the top end of the table. That's until the time is right.
This makes a lot of sense to me.

Tornante have just invested a new tranche of money into the club. They aren't writing that money off, they want to recoup their investment and make a profit on it.
you say they arent writing it off, but by putting it into the club as equity and not as a loan they put that investment at risk.
If the money was loaned to club, if they decide to sell that loan would have to be repaid, by putting it as equity, if the club is sold, they only get what the club is worth at the time, so if we dropped leagues they would likely lose out.
so yes they want a return on that investment, but its an investment more to the benefit of the club than them
In fairness, as we saw with the Gaydamaks, etc., if they input the capital as a loan, and the company were to go into administration or liquidation, that loan is still very much at risk. As you say, if the value of the equity falls, due to relegation, then they would certainly lose out. Which makes it all the more certain that they will make sure we go upwards not downwards.

I believe the owners will want the club to be moving upwards but, for me, I think it is the time frame that is in question. Nevertheless, I agree that the idea of downward movement is an anathema to them and they will make sure, as far as they can, that their investment is protected. I think that the bottom line is year on year improvement until they have the club in a position that will sustain a higher level.
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