The fans are now turning on the Eisners

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Selsey Bill
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The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Selsey Bill »

I am sure you have already noticed, but more and more Pompey fans are beginning to voice their disappointment at our current owners. No doubt this is directly related to performances on the pitch, which must surely be beginning to put Jackett under pressure, even though he has their support? If we were flying in the league as we were this time last year then I doubt fans would have the same issues. However, we're not and our style of football has been poor, to say the least. Whilst we were doing well on the pitch a year ago, we’ve gone backwards since January. Also, there appears to have been no investment in the academy, and I’m no buying most of the rhetoric currently coming out of the club.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by No Shot Sherlock »

Selsey Bill wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:19 pm I am sure you have already noticed, but more and more Pompey fans are beginning to voice their disappointment at our current owners. No doubt this is directly related to performances on the pitch, which must surely be beginning to put Jackett under pressure, even though he has their support? If we were flying in the league as we were this time last year then I doubt fans would have the same issues. However, we're not and our style of football has been poor, to say the least. Whilst we were doing well on the pitch a year ago, we’ve gone backwards since January. Also, there appears to have been no investment in the academy, and I’m no buying most of the rhetoric currently coming out of the club.
If I were the Eisners reading that post, Bill, I'd be very worried. You've always been a glass half full man, indeed some would say you're the eternal optimist, so if you're losing patience then it won't be long before the pitchforks are out!
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Dinksy »

Okay, I'll give you one thing - that the delay in an announcement over the stadium is a cause of frustration. And that does not seem to be the fault of the club but other agencies they have to deal with like Network Rail. However I'm afraid you're wide of the mark in respect of the academy, SB. The club have invested more than £100,000 in the academy in the past year. That's on top of the lottery money it gets. They have brought in experienced figures like Sean O'Driscoll to the coaching and scouting network, Neil Sillett into recruitment and are ear-marking HMS Collingwood as a possible permenant home for it.
Additionally, Tornante have spent over £5m on infrastructure projects in and around Fratton Park since they took over - new girders, new wiring, new south stand roof, new overhang for the disabled fans.
Tornante could have just sat back and said what's the point of investing in the ground if we might be moving to another location but they have tried to upgrade exactly in line with their original committment. Yes, things are not great on the pitch but that will change. And even if we don't go up this year, I would rather spend another year in League One than struggle like Barnsley and Luton are doing.
We need to hold our nerve and have some faith.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

Dinksy wrote:Okay, I'll give you one thing - that the delay in an announcement over the stadium is a cause of frustration. And that does not seem to be the fault of the club but other agencies they have to deal with like Network Rail. However I'm afraid you're wide of the mark in respect of the academy, SB. The club have invested more than £100,000 in the academy in the past year. That's on top of the lottery money it gets. They have brought in experienced figures like Sean O'Driscoll to the coaching and scouting network, Neil Sillett into recruitment and are ear-marking HMS Collingwood as a possible permenant home for it.
Additionally, Tornante have spent over £5m on infrastructure projects in and around Fratton Park since they took over - new girders, new wiring, new south stand roof, new overhang for the disabled fans.
Tornante could have just sat back and said what's the point of investing in the ground if we might be moving to another location but they have tried to upgrade exactly in line with their original committment. Yes, things are not great on the pitch but that will change. And even if we don't go up this year, I would rather spend another year in League One than struggle like Barnsley and Luton are doing.
We need to hold our nerve and have some faith.
Academy-Dave Wright left & took others with him because they backtracked on their pledge to go to Academy status 2. I don't think Tornante fully realised the financial requirement to go to a class 2 academy & the likely output of players from it is small. So I think on that one they're correct in saying its too much money for a L1 club.
Infrastructure-well yes they've done various things but I completely disagree about being inline with the original commitment. I & I guess a lot of other shareholders wouldn't have voted yes to the takeover for a roof over the SS & new floodlights. The original commitment was to completely revamp FP-we are no nearer. To try & blame railtrack etc is crackers, why should railtrack pay for something that only benefits PFC. The very idea I thought was silly & its a poor excuse imo. Why not just put a planning application in & see what transpires.
Disabled people are still getting soaked & still relying on the PST providing hot drinks @ HT, not PFC. I'm shocked by that tbh. Its poor oh so poor.
I say things as I see them, I have no agenda against Tornante. I was excited as the rest when they took over. Now though, 2 1/2 yrs later the masterplan is still unknown & MC says if railtrack wont build the bridge & pay for it (yeah righto Mark) then the revamp is on hold. I have to say its sounds to me like they've got a severe case of cold feet.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Dinksy »

I think it's a matter of priorities. The past two years have been largely spent on:
1. Seeing that Fratton Park wasn't drastically reduced in capacity, or at worst, closed down completely due to safety issues. I don't think supporters realise how close we came to losing our certification. Ask anyone at the council.
2. Shoring up the rusting stands. That meant digging up the foundations and refurbishing each of the girders.
At the time Tornante took over there was £5m I think Catlin said that had to be spent over the following five years to keep FP open. The Eisners pledged that cash and they have done it in under three. They have been completely consistent with their original statement of intent.
The bigger picture is complicated due to the various hurdles connected with staying in Fratton, not just about Network Rail.
Anyway all shall be revealed very soon.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

Dinksy wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 9:02 pm I think it's a matter of priorities. The past two years have been largely spent on:
1. Seeing that Fratton Park wasn't drastically reduced in capacity, or at worst, closed down completely due to safety issues. I don't think supporters realise how close we came to losing our certification. Ask anyone at the council.
2. Shoring up the rusting stands. That meant digging up the foundations and refurbishing each of the girders.
At the time Tornante took over there was £5m I think Catlin said that had to be spent over the following five years to keep FP open. The Eisners pledged that cash and they have done it in under three. They have been completely consistent with their original statement of intent.
The bigger picture is complicated due to the various hurdles connected with staying in Fratton, not just about Network Rail.
Anyway all shall be revealed very soon.
Indeed it will but no.1 is wrong mate. That was spin put out by the pro Tornante lobby @ the time prior to The Guildhall. The ground was never in imminent danger of being closed down.
Thoughts on disabled fans-still getting soaked, relying on the goodwill of the PST for hot beverages @ HT?
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Dinksy »

My source for that was not Tornante propaganda but the council and the point was that capacity reduction was the imminent threat because of the health and safety issue and closure was a real possibility further down the line due to the foundation work. These are facts, not spin that have been bourne out by the work of the last two years plus.
If anyone is determined to see the dark side, there is always fodder there. You can talk about Dave Wright quitting and ignore the excellent recruits of O'Driscoll (former No.2 at Liverpool) and Sillett, you can point out the lack of a fanzone and forget about the excellent Pompey Store or the refurbishment of the Chimes Lounge. Personally, I'm not happy about now paying over four quid for a pint and yes, I know the club are working on making a better experience for disabled fans. If there are still some who are unhappy, I would like to know what attempts have been made by them or the PST to bring it to the club's attention. In the broad sweep of things I can see progress (off the field) and believe we are moving forward, albeit slowly.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

No "dark side",no agenda Dinksy. But lets not confuse maintenance with what was promised & thus far hasn't been indicated how it will be delivered.
O'Driscoll-you do know his nickname is O'Dismal?
I want to see something concrete, not wishy washy plans that wont go forward because Railtrack wont build a bridge. Its all far too convenient.
And again I have to ask about the disabled fans, still getting soaked & relying on the pst for hot drinks @ ht. Mr Eisner promised a better fan experience-try telling the disabled fans its better.
I will praise when its due, but tarting up the existing ground wont earn it from me. I didnt vote to sell for a better victory club, to do maintenance etc. I voted to sell because they said they would sort out the ground once & for all. Still waiting.....
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Dinksy »

Okay fair enough. (Didn't know that about 'dismal'). Perhaps 'dark' was a tad too satanic :lol:
We'll just have to see - I agree that patience is running a bit thin for the bigger scheme of things and I think the club realise that too. It is an important debate and I would like to know what other people think.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

Dinksy wrote:Okay fair enough. (Didn't know that about 'dismal'). Perhaps 'dark' was a tad too satanic :lol:
We'll just have to see - I agree that patience is running a bit thin for the bigger scheme of things and I think the club realise that too. It is an important debate and I would like to know what other people think.
Cheers Dinksy. :thumb I think we all want whats best for the club.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Milton End »

Selsey Bill wrote: Wed Nov 20, 2019 5:19 pm I am sure you have already noticed, but more and more Pompey fans are beginning to voice their disappointment at our current owners.
Apologies, but where you get your facts regarding 'more and more.?'

Yes, there are some fans who would be unhappy at anything other than immediate promotion to the PL. But 'more and more' is amazingly vague and unsubstantiated.

From my admittedly limited perspective, I suspect the Eisners never fully understood how badly Pompey had been drained by the previous owners - except, naturally, for the fan ownership period. Frankly, we were on life-support with the threat of partial ground closure before the Tornante takeover in my judgement.

What bothers me is that people are now highly critical and have no patience whatsoever. Major planning, design and related issues take many months, even years, to resolve for any company.

Equally, promotion is partly a matter of luck - injuries, weather, etc - as well as management. Yes, the season has been very disappointing - so far. But we have some good players and we almost made the Championship last season. We really do need to get behind the team over the next few weeks.

Let's face the fact that the Eisners now own the club and are unlikely to sell because 'more and more' Pompey fans are disappointed = so far.

In my judgement, the Tornante slow-but-steady approach to investment is more likely to deliver in the long run than the wildly fluctuating levels of investment in some other clubs over recent years. And it's exactly what the Eisners promised when they purchased the club.
Milton End is entering a new era with Tornante
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by NSRailings »

pompeygunner wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:10 am I want
'Nuff said

The Eisner's will be aiming to make PFC a successful and self sustaining club sooner rather than later - that's why they bought it. They will be coming up against a load of obstacles - legal as well as some driven by self interest. I think there are supporters who are naive and don't realise how difficult and time consuming these things are. It doesn't matter how much money you have, achieving things is never straight foward.

So wise up and have some patience.
Super Matt Macey in goal...
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

NSRailings wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 6:26 pm
pompeygunner wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 9:10 am I want
'Nuff said

The Eisner's will be aiming to make PFC a successful and self sustaining club sooner rather than later - that's why they bought it. They will be coming up against a load of obstacles - legal as well as some driven by self interest. I think there are supporters who are naive and don't realise how difficult and time consuming these things are. It doesn't matter how much money you have, achieving things is never straight foward.

So wise up and have some patience.
Err no. Wise up after 51 yrs of going up the Park, why break the habit of a lifetime. :D
But being serious, if you're going to quote me use the full thing . Its also got nothing to do with impatience & everything to do with the club being stupid about expecting Railtrack to fund a bridge that PFC fans will virtually soley get the use of. The other stuff I was just correcting Dinksy ref some inaccuracies in his post.
:thumb
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by Dinksy »

And that is where you undermine your own credibility, Mr Gunner. There were no "inaccuracies" in my posts. All the events I have mentioned above actually happened, are part of the record and easily checkable. We have a difference of opinion regarding which events are most important and how we interpret them. Fair enough. But it is disingenuous to try and discredit facts that possibly don't support your views. I hope that you are simply not mindful enough to know the difference rather than making mischief when you do.
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Re: The fans are now turning on the Eisners

Post by pompeygunner »

Dinksy wrote: Thu Nov 21, 2019 7:30 pm And that is where you undermine your own credibility, Mr Gunner. There were no "inaccuracies" in my posts. All the events I have mentioned above actually happened, are part of the record and easily checkable. We have a difference of opinion regarding which events are most important and how we interpret them. Fair enough. But it is disingenuous to try and discredit facts that possibly don't support your views. I hope that you are simply not mindful enough to know the difference rather than making mischief when you do.
No mischief making here Dinksy & again I have to disagree. Those close to the PST know full well FP was never close to being closed. How about naming the Council source?
They rowed back on the academy-Dave Wright & others left because of it.
Maintenance is not the same as revamping FP-its inaccurate to use maintenance as a sign they are fulfilling their promises about revamping the ground. I could go on mate but I think people are probably getting bored with it now.
Look, the owners deserved to be questioned. Imagine if the ownership in the past hadn't been. And don't forget Michael & Eric aren't your mates, behind the smiles are hard nosed businessmen looking to make a profit. Its important we all remember that. As I said I'll give credit when its due & for me that's mainly regarding a proper FP revamp, not a tart up nor essential maintenance that any responsible owner should do.
I sold my share reluctantly because I believed they would sort out the ground once & for all after Michael's pitch @ The Guildhall, imo that's what they will be judged on. So yes I'm impatient but only because I think with the Ground sorted Pompey can finally achieve its true potential. Something that's been denied us through rotten ownership for far too long.
Finally if you truly believe these events as you stated them are true come over onto The Pompey Forum & stick your head above the parapet with these claims. There are a lot of people, ex Presidents, ex PST board members who will be happy to give you the real version of what transpired 2 1/2 yrs ago.
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