General chat room. Pompey related or not, but PLEASE keep it reasonably clean.

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#898574
Change of tack. What do you do if you see someone breaking the rules? The only incident that I have been involved in was when a group of about 6 cyclists came in to our coffee shop without masks standing close together and made no attempt to distance themselves from my wife and I as we tried to get past them on our way out. I glowered. Then told them they should be ashamed of themselves. At least I felt better even if it didn't do any good.

Most people I see out in Lymington High Street make no attempt even to keep 1 metre away. It's pointless trying to say anything to anyone. I just walk in the road when I can.
#898575
I haven't really seen anyone blatantly breaking the rules tbh. Although I probably wouldn't do anything unless someone purposely coughed on me or something in which case I've still got a pretty good right hand from my boxing days which they'd feel the end of 😂

There will now be more widespread rule breaking due to this rule of 6 nonsense and such . Will I be grassing up neighbours for having friends round ? Hell no
#898578
Mr D Nuts wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 1:57 pm
No, and having now read a more in depth report it appears the prime minister has just declared war on his own people with talk of bringing in the military.
I respect your honesty. I'm usually fairly libertarian but I look back to May \ June and when we were having over 1,000 deaths a day and just don't see that as acceptable. If there are things that can be done to reduce the chance of that happening again then, providing they are proportionate, I'm happy for them to be put in place again to, hopefully, avoid the same death rate or at least temper it as much as possible.

I'm a facts based guy though. If anyone can provide any sort of proof that those numbers decreasing in the time after lockdown was introduced was down to anything other than the measures put in place I'd be happy to reconsider my view.

Your point on side affects of people dying due to operations being cancelled etc is a fair one and the long term affects will be looked at for decades to come but don't forget these would be the same people who would have more chance of catching covid had they had to go to hospital and has we not seen the reduction in numbers in hospitals admissions over the last few months then it's highly unlikely that there would have been capacity for these people to have been see anyway.

To put things in perspective though I think it's fair to look at excess over the first half of the year compared to the previous years which stands at 65,000. While it's going to be difficult to know the exact number of long term deaths due to people not going to hospital due to beds being taken over with covid victims and operations being cancelled it's also worth bearing in mind there are long term affects of covid on people as well that will also need to be taken into account.

I find it ironic your main point was that you don't like the idea of people not being able to go to hospital but in my mind without the previous restrictions being put in place then hospitals would still be full of covid cases and without the new restrictions we could see the hospitals overrun meaning there would be no room for them anyway.
#898583
Agree with it or not that's by the by, I was surprised to see there has been no restriction on visiting another household as in the home (or home of others) is where.most transmission seems to be taking place and I can understand why, it's hard to keep your distance in most homes and people feel comfortable and safe I was almost certain that was coming today.
#898589
Pompey1984+1 wrote:
Tue Sep 22, 2020 10:36 pm
Agree with it or not that's by the by, I was surprised to see there has been no restriction on visiting another household as in the home (or home of others) is where.most transmission seems to be taking place and I can understand why, it's hard to keep your distance in most homes and people feel comfortable and safe I was almost certain that was coming today.
They've done that in Scotland:

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-scotland-54254694
#898636
Mr D Nuts wrote:
Mon Sep 21, 2020 2:17 pm
A load of ifs ands and buts. They say cases are doubling every 7 days which is contrary to what their own graph shows. Then the cone up with some exorbitant numbers of what going to happen in a month.

It's now clear that lockdowns and masks don't work. Lockdowns just hide the virus for a while and positive tests have risen since the introduction of masks.

I still haven't worked out why these lunatics are hell bent on ruining the country.

If there's another lockdown I imagine there will be serious unrest and public disorder . No furlough and different weather this time.
Unfortunately they are being proven right and you wrong Mr Nuts. The number of daily cases are more than doubling every 7 days which would mean 50,000 a day by mid October if that trajectory continues and with that will come a large increase in the number of deaths. Do lockdowns and masks work? Depends what "work" means. They are now proven to slow the spread but unless we all lockdown completely this virus is not going away any time soon.
#898637
It's not going away period. Personally these new rules don't impact me too much, the pub I tend to go to has been doing table service since it reopened and has limited numbers, and has been closing at 10pm anyway.

The things I'm really starting to struggle with is that I have absolutely nothing in my diary to look forward to, no football matches to go to, no trips to see friends or anything, no holidays nothing like that. Just one long winter of dark damp and cold with the long commute upstairs everyday.... It's just crap!

There is no doubting that this thing exists and it can be serious equally it's definitely on the rise, but it feels a little like there is no real understanding about what's causing the rise. Do we know for certain where people are catching it? This new app doesn't help with that either really. If we knew that most of these new transmissions were happening in a certain environment they could be closed, or worked in to reduce the risk.

I don't see wide scale rule breaking as such mostly just people not wearing masks or rather people wearing them but under their chin for some reason.
#898638
Ok GB, but please explain how masks work when since the rules about wearing them were brought in positive tests are on the rise? Millions of people are now wearing them more so surely if they had any effect we shouldn't be seeing such steep rises. It's also interesting to note that flu deaths are average for the time of year so it seems masks are ineffective.

What do you mean by lockdown completely? That's impossible unless you want everyone to starve to death or die of other things aswell.
The only way out is learning to live with it .
#898640
Pompey1984+1 wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:26 am
It's not going away period. Personally these new rules don't impact me too much, the pub I tend to go to has been doing table service since it reopened and has limited numbers, and has been closing at 10pm anyway.

The things I'm really starting to struggle with is that I have absolutely nothing in my diary to look forward to, no football matches to go to, no trips to see friends or anything, no holidays nothing like that. Just one long winter of dark damp and cold with the long commute upstairs everyday.... It's just crap!

There is no doubting that this thing exists and it can be serious equally it's definitely on the rise, but it feels a little like there is no real understanding about what's causing the rise. Do we know for certain where people are catching it? This new app doesn't help with that either really. If we knew that most of these new transmissions were happening in a certain environment they could be closed, or worked in to reduce the risk.

I don't see wide scale rule breaking as such mostly just people not wearing masks or rather people wearing them but under their chin for some reason.
i saw some interesting statistics from ONS yesterday. Which I'll have a look for again later. The majority of transmission is still taking place in care homes , closely followed by places of education .
The hospitality industry accounts for just 5% of positive tests yet the Johnson dictatorship hammers them with rules that will bankrupt many. They seem to unnecessarily have it in for anything that gives people pleasure or is fun.

Another interesting piece i read yesterday was that Belgium have now done away with the PCR test as it is inaccurate and throws up too many false positives.
Something which Dominic raab spike about on sky news the other day.
#898641
Masks do work imo. Its just a certain section of the populace are bloody stupid about wearing them. I got laughed @ by some silly old sod in my local High St for wearing one. My reply was I'd rather wear a mask than a ventilator!! Social distancing- rare in my part of the world. Oh & I saw pics of students in Guildhall Walk, not a mask in view & no social distancing. Until the ignorant section of the public get real & stop putting us all @ risk then this virus will just keep spreading.
#898642
Mr D Nuts wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 6:51 am
I saw some interesting statistics from ONS yesterday. Which I'll have a look for again later. The majority of transmission is still taking place in care homes
I'm in danger of agreeing with you over something. Some local authorities have been asking care homes to take on Covid Positive residents. This was from the 17th September.

https://www.channel4.com/news/revealed- ... l-patients

Care homes have also being offered cash incentives to take on Covid cases. This is from August 28th.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/2020/0 ... -patients/
#898643
I think that the masks and social distancing measures are having a positive effect because whilst the cases are going up it isn't anything like the scale of March/April. However I do think that businesses etc. that have shown themselves to be COVID safe and have all the protocols in place should be allowed to continue operating unless an outbreak is linked to them. It seems illogical to me that you can sit in a plane with 300 people for hours in close proximity but you can't sit 2 rows away from people in an outdoor football stadium.
#898644
My understanding is that when changes are made it takes a number of weeks \ months for the case numbers to follow (up or down) and then hospitalisation and ultimately deaths follow an additional period of time from them.

IMO the figures we see today are a response to Eat Out To Help Out and the busy summer holidays. I was in Norfolk over August and we went out to Yarmouth on one day and it was the busiest I've seen it in decades.

If the number of cases going up is as a result of actions taken in August and on top of that we've had schools open, students go back to uni and care homes being asked to take on known sick people then it probably won't be until November \ December we see the real picture of how that affects the hospitals.

I know we disagree on a lot but I do agree with your previous point about wanting to ensure hospitals remain effective. The potential issue of having them overrun unable to cope with a potential winter covid surge (which is a traditionally busy time for hospitals anyway) is detrimental to that. If there's only one thing we should all agree on then it's ensuring that this Winter the NHS can cope with any surge and part of this unfortunately is going to be about trying to slow down the spread. From day 1 it's always been about "flattening the curve" and ensuring that the NHS isn't overwhelmed.

You talk about "learning to live with it" and again I agree. I'm sure we will disagree on the minutia and everyone on here will have a slightly different take on what it means in practice but to me "learning to live with it" is about getting that balance right between opening the economy and ensuring the NHS isn't overwhelmed. We've already seen from earlier in the year how lock down can reduce the death rate but also saw how long it took to turn the tide once those measures were put in place.

I'm hopeful that due to less targeted testing, despite cases increasing, we're still behind where we were when we saw this level of positive results earlier in the year. Ultimately death per capita (or positive test) and changes in average death rate against previous years is going to be the key data to look for.

Time will tell of course and it's not going to be long before we know for sure whether relative death rates will continue to rise or not. Perhaps we'll be pleasantly surprised and they won't. I wont take it for granted though and neither should the government.
#898645
PakefieldBlue wrote:
Fri Sep 25, 2020 8:34 am
I think that the masks and social distancing measures are having a positive effect because whilst the cases are going up it isn't anything like the scale of March/April. However I do think that businesses etc. that have shown themselves to be COVID safe and have all the protocols in place should be allowed to continue operating unless an outbreak is linked to them. It seems illogical to me that you can sit in a plane with 300 people for hours in close proximity but you can't sit 2 rows away from people in an outdoor football stadium.
I covered it above but as it's less targeted testing then I'm hopeful we're behind where we were earlier in the yeah despite having more positive tests. The relative death rates are going to be the key data point here though and unfortunately we won't know for sure until the winter or early next year. I guess the question is do you err on the side of caution knowing death rates are already increasing or accept it as "collateral damage" and continue as normal.

As for the plane comment don't forget you need to self isolate for two weeks when returning from some countries. Would you be up for self isolating for two weeks after every game lol?
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