Minimal fan return with face coverings.

[Dinksy]

Face-coverings is the final nail in the coffin for the High Street.
Interesting isn't it how all these measures make all of us more measurable.

[Mr Dee]

Face-coverings is the final nail in the coffin for the High Street.
Interesting isn't it how all these measures make all of us more measurable.

I agree . Normal is never coming back IMO. What is it now , week 20 of 3 weeks to flatten a curve ? which is now so flat the walls are jealous. Yet now it's masks in shops and no doubt next it will beyou can't get rid of the mask unless you have a vaccine .

[Sam_Brown]

Face-coverings is the final nail in the coffin for the High Street.
Interesting isn't it how all these measures make all of us more measurable.

I agree . Normal is never coming back IMO. What is it now , week 20 of 3 weeks to flatten a curve ? which is now so flat the walls are jealous. Yet now it's masks in shops and no doubt next it will beyou can't get rid of the mask unless you have a vaccine .

Week 20 of herd immunity maybe?

[Mr Dee]

Face-coverings is the final nail in the coffin for the High Street.
Interesting isn't it how all these measures make all of us more measurable.

I agree . Normal is never coming back IMO. What is it now , week 20 of 3 weeks to flatten a curve ? which is now so flat the walls are jealous. Yet now it's masks in shops and no doubt next it will beyou can't get rid of the mask unless you have a vaccine .

Week 20 of herd immunity maybe?

Probably . I notice that thankfully the death rate is now so low people just go on about the new case numbers, which unless hospitalisations or death rates start to rise aswell makes them no cause for concern . And probably means we are achieving some herd immunity.

[Pompey1984+1]

As part of my job I've been heavily involved in the organisations response to covid, we were an area of concern around the time that Leicester went into lockdown and despite the increased testing due to being an area of concern cases have fallen.

What I find interesting is that the response to being a concern is more testing, which it would seem in places uncovers more cases because so many people have it and don't know.

The outbreaks seen to centre around three settings, but the one that is happening most is workplaces - that being said the raw numbers of positive results needed to be defined as an outbreak at a workplace isn't very high at all, and it's a raw number not a percentage of workforce.

Until there is better data coming through its very difficult to do much of any use of the data fed out from public health England at a local level.

I beleive the local level is going to be where this thing gets controlled and eventually beaten but to do that it needs to be understood more, numbers at a national or regional level don't really help, and I'm not even sure they do at a local authority level.

I think it would be really interesting to carry out the regular football club style testing on a small street, or village only this way do I feel we will start to learn where individuals are picking up the virus or not. When we understand where the most transmission is taking place we can start to understand how to reduce it, what parts of life can get back to a more normal new normal.

Until that time I think we're going to be stuck in this situation or a vaccine which may or may not work comes along.

But I personally feel learning to live with it stands more chance than eradicating it.

[GreenBlue]

One thing we all must agree on is that we all either agree with eachother, partly agree with eachother or completely dissagree with each other. Except those who don't.

You're wrong. As usual

[Sam_Brown]

As part of my job I've been heavily involved in the organisations response to covid, we were an area of concern around the time that Leicester went into lockdown and despite the increased testing due to being an area of concern cases have fallen.

What I find interesting is that the response to being a concern is more testing, which it would seem in places uncovers more cases because so many people have it and don't know.

The outbreaks seen to centre around three settings, but the one that is happening most is workplaces - that being said the raw numbers of positive results needed to be defined as an outbreak at a workplace isn't very high at all, and it's a raw number not a percentage of workforce.

Until there is better data coming through its very difficult to do much of any use of the data fed out from public health England at a local level.

I beleive the local level is going to be where this thing gets controlled and eventually beaten but to do that it needs to be understood more, numbers at a national or regional level don't really help, and I'm not even sure they do at a local authority level.

I think it would be really interesting to carry out the regular football club style testing on a small street, or village only this way do I feel we will start to learn where individuals are picking up the virus or not. When we understand where the most transmission is taking place we can start to understand how to reduce it, what parts of life can get back to a more normal new normal.

Until that time I think we're going to be stuck in this situation or a vaccine which may or may not work comes along.

But I personally feel learning to live with it stands more chance than eradicating it.

I read a good article on the testing the other day. I’ll see if I can dig it out. It was more a response to trumps comments along the same line but I think the logic still stands.

So if you test more people then yes you will get more positive results. What the article went on to mention is that what ultimately matters is the ratio of tests to positive results.

So for example if you test 100 people and 5 are positive you get a 1 in 20 infection rate. If you test 200 and 20 are positive then you can argue of course there are more positives as you’ve tested more people but more importantly is that that 20 in 200 is a 1 in 10 infection rate. And that’s the important figured.

I agree with your point about living with it though. From everything I’ve read it’s never going to be eradicated 100%.

The point of contention is going to be getting that balance between mitigating the risk of another peak while realising that we can’t go on like this forever and the economy does need to start to open up again. What makes this so difficult is that everyone’s idea of what is and isn’t an acceptable risk and level of infection is different. There are some who probably feel we should have never gone into lockdown, masks are an affront to free speech and that the economy is the only thing that matters. On the flip side you’ve got people that feel that any death is too much and until the virus is 100% eradicated we should continue to be in a national lockdown for the next 15 years if that’s what it takes. What does eventually happen will obviously be somewhere in between.

[Pompey1984+1]

Exactly that - furthermore you need to know if you keep testing the same people!

[Mr Dee]

Judging by this report plus many other stats I've seen the risk is now minute .
https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/22/nearly-t ... ssion=true

[Sam_Brown]

Judging by this report plus many other stats I've seen the risk is now minute .
https://metro.co.uk/2020/07/22/nearly-t ... ssion=true

That’s some good news then. The key is to keep it that way.

[No Shot Sherlock]

The way I increasingly see it is, until there's an effective vaccine we're fooked More people will die. More people will lose their jobs. More people will suffer all kinds of social, medical and mental disadvantage. There will be very few winners, but the longer it takes to find that vaccine the more losers there will be.

As I said some while ago, I'm glad I'm not one of those having to make the decisions, but I have one suggestion that could possibly be worth implementing at some stage. Temporarily drop the State retirement age to 62 for anyone who wants it. This in theory will open up opportunities across all job sectors, allowing younger people to step up into more senior roles and those without a job to secure one at the base of the employment pyramid.

No idea what the tax implication of paying all those extra State pensions would be, but it can't be any more expensive than paying benefits to three million unemployed.

[Sam_Brown]

The way I increasingly see it is, until there's an effective vaccine we're fooked More people will die. More people will lose their jobs. More people will suffer all kinds of social, medical and mental disadvantage. There will be very few winners, but the longer it takes to find that vaccine the more losers there will be.

As I said some while ago, I'm glad I'm not one of those having to make the decisions, but I have one suggestion that could possibly be worth implementing at some stage. Temporarily drop the State retirement age to 62 for anyone who wants it. This in theory will open up opportunities across all job sectors, allowing younger people to step up into more senior roles and those without a job to secure one at the base of the employment pyramid.

No idea what the tax implication of paying all those extra State pensions would be, but it can't be any more expensive than paying benefits to three million unemployed.

There was an article that came out on Friday that said current pension costs are expected to be £100bn lower as a result of corona so you might be on to something here. It's not a comfortable discussion to have obviously and feels a bit more utilitarian than I'm used to but you could also take into account how many people have died in care homes and how much money that might free up as well.

I've not read the details and I know the recent fertility drops in the UK as well as well as the exiting pension deficits probably should be taken into account as well but it's definitely worth a deeper look.

https://www.thisismoney.co.uk/money/mar ... costs.html

[Mr Dee]

I'm going to hazard a guess the NSS is 62

[Sam_Brown]

I'm going to hazard a guess the NSS is 62

[No Shot Sherlock]

I'm going to hazard a guess the NSS is 62

I'm already retired